The Ultimate Showdown Part 1

ETC nation, we are about to embark on a first here at ETC ETC ETC. A casual email about the "100 movies to see before you die" has turned into a serious back and forth email conversation between myself and Mr. IMDB himself, Lenny the Critic. Not only did we have an email chain going, but we were also having a Gmail Chat at the same time, so some of our conversation will be mixed in to the conversation as well.

So lets get right into and understand that both myself and Mr. IMDB himself, Lenny the Critic agree that we could write an entire book on this......

(Be sure to click the link so you can follow along with the list of the movies for each year)

Mr. IMDB, Lenny the Critic: Count how many movies you have seen on this list and then compare

http://movies.yahoo.com/feature/100-movies-to-see-before-you-die-modern-classics.html

ETC: this would be a stellar blog entry. i think we should have good back and forth email convo about this and get it up on the blog. this is heavy though so its going to have to be well analyzed and broken up into segments.

Mr. IMDB, LTC: most underrated on the list in my opinion is the Matrix



I thought the first installment of the Matrix is one of the most clever movies i had seen, not to mention the sick special effects for a movie made in the 90s

ETC: definitely the most creative/innovative/copied movies probably on that list. im not sure if its underrated, i feel like everyones seen it or at least heard about it. i might have to give the underrated award to almost famous. that doesn't even have a little tag next to it that says "why you should see it"

Mr. IMDB, LTC: almost famous is a very good movie, but in my opinion its rewatchability is suspect


a very underrated movie that i just saw looking through it again is Memento. Christopher Nolan, the guy who directed the new batman movies, directed it. one of those movies that messes with your head to the point where you have no idea whats going on until the very end, much like Basic.

ETC: very true. almost famous is a little slow and parts do drag, but i like it alot. memento is great, thats very under the radar

ok so i like the breakdown so far, that can be a great intro to start off the blog convo but lets do this by 3 year periods and then some major awards like best of the list, underrated/overrated, worst movie(shouldnt be on the list) etc....

so starting with 1990-1992 i think the best movies from this period are CLEARLY goodfellas and silence of the lambs with thelma and louise, beauty and the beast and unforgiven just behind. in fact that would be my top 5 from this block. I'd even nominate Goodfellas to be a potential top 3/5 of this entire list.

For the most part the movies listed are pretty solid and should be on the list but clearly there are some that shouldn't be on there and some others that have been left off.

i have a big problem with 1992. I've never even heard of hard boiled (im guessing its foreign), ive never seen the player, no way supercop should be on there, and raise the red lantern looks foreign too.

some noticable absentees include...
1990- home alone, pretty woman
1991- point break (even though it shouldnt be on the list i love it and want to talk about it)
1992- reservoir dogs, a league of their own, a few good men

Mr. IMDB, LTC: I honestly dont think i could disagree with anything you just said



Goodfellas is definitely at the top of the list in this group followed by silence of the lambs


I think this list is solid with a few childhood favorites in which i would put in, including one that are in my personal top 5 favorite movies. A few of movies that I personally love are Home Alone (1990), Ninja Turtles (1990), The Mighty Ducks (1992) Aladdin (1992), and two movies that are in my personal overall top 5 favorite movies (very bold), which are Hook (1991)


I would agree that 1992 is the most overrated, based on the fact that there are so many movies that I never even heard of.

ETC: totally forgot about and overlooked hook. that is a great movie. its tough with movies that are perceived to be kids movies. home alone is probably the best example and hook should be in the discussion also of movies that resonate, everyone has seen them and theyre still as good now as when they were when you first saw them.
*G-Chat Convo:

i love aladdin the most above turtles and ducks and i guess if beauty and the beast is on their list aladdin should get some consideration as well. but aladdin just goes with the 3 that i listed that were left off the list that all 4 seem to be more deserving than the ones on the list. i think if for our list 1992 begins with a few good men, a league of their own, reservoir dogs, aladdin and then you can make an argument for unforgiven and malcolm x.

Mr. IMDB, LTC: 1993: You cant really argue that these three shouldnt be on the list, all three are classic movies in such different ways. Dazed and confused is a great movie with one of the greatest cameo appearnances by Matthew McConaughey. "That's what I love about these high school girls, man. I get older, they stay the same age." Grounhog day is classic Bill Murray, enough said. Schindler's list, arguably the most powerful movie ever made.


Movies that I think could be argued to be in there; Jurassic Park, The Fugitive, The Pelican Brief


Personal favorites: Mrs Doubtfire, Cool Runnings, Rookie of the Year, and my number 1 overal favorite movie The Sandlot

ETC: Im with you on the movies that are listed. Dazed and Confused is such a generational movie in that it perfectly defined an era. granted it was a look back, but it really captured an entire way of life. And I couldn't agree more about McConaughey, could easily be one of the best cameos. That quote is amazing.

Groundhog Day is Bill Murray at his finest and really shows that he can do more than just be funny, that he is an excellent actor period.

You can't dispute Schindler's List. the only possible thing against that is the rewatchability is not there, but I think that is a testament to how powerful the movie is.

Jurassic Park has to be on this list, no questions asked. It's a great suspense movie and it's one of the most memorable movies not only of this particular year but possibly of all time. Couldn't agree more about the sandlot. we all know how we feel about that movie

Some huge noticable missing ones in addition to those you had are.......

a bronx tale, cool runnings, grumpy old men, rudy, the firm, the fugitive.

I think Rudy has to be on the list. It's one of the only movies that has the potential to make grown men cry

Mr. IMDB, LTC: 1994:



There are a lot of movies from this year, but I have only seen three, and all three are no brainers on the list. Forrest Gump, Shawshank, and Pulp Fiction. All phenomenal movies with incredible performances. Easily Hanks’ best movie, Robbins and Freeman in a perfectly told story, and Tarantino at his best.


I am blindly going to award Jim Carrey with the most snubs in a year award in 1993. Two of which are classics, 1 is just a movie I like.


I would argue before seeing the rest of the years that 1994 is at the top of the snubs list, on both a personal level and great movie level. Here is the list: The Lion King, Dumb & Dumber, Clear and Present Danger, Ace Ventura, Angels in the Outfield, D2 The Mighty Ducks, Major League 2, The Mask.


*G-Chat Convo: dude, 94 and 95 have an all-star cast of snubs. i thought 94 was bad, and i just looked at 95 and it might take the cake *
 
ETC: Agreed with your assessment of the movies listed. Gump, Shawshank and Pulp Fiction should be on the list. Gump is in my personal top 3 of all time, I mean its got everything you can ask for in a movie. It's funny, its sad, its got war scenes/action and its Tom Hanks at the top of his game. Shawshank gives me chills everytime i watch it. "hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things". And while I personally like Reservoir Dogs better then Pulp Fiction as a whole (story, development etc) Pulp is the more "fun" movie to watch. It's style has been copied so much since then its amazing. But the other 3 movies they have listed are tragedies when you look at some of the snubs.

Jim Carrey's career was essentially made in this year, which is incredible. The fact that Ace Ventura, The Mask and Dumb and Dumber all came out in the same year is shocking. 1 of those movies has to be on any list, and I'd argue that all 3 belong on the list for that matter. That has to be the best year a comedian has ever had in terms of movies. I can't imagine a better year than that? Can you think of any better year for a comedian?

Definitely agree about Lion King, I think it's my favorite disney movie and deserves some recognition. Clear and Present Danger, D2 and Major League 2 deserve to be talked about, especially CPD, but I think in comparison to the 3 that are originally listed and the Jim Carrey snubs, I dont think those should make the list

*G-Chat Convo: its crazy how many are left off, not to mention the ones they listed for the most part should be on there though. Jim Carrey's career was made that year, its incredible and none of them are on the list*

Mr. IMDB, LTC: 1995:



I need to retract my previous statement about 1994 being the top of the snub list, because we now have a new heir to the throne. I have seen 4 movies in here, but know about most of them. Toy Story, if I am not mistaken, is Pixar’s first bigtime movie in a line of great animated movies, with the classic quote “To infinity, AND BEYOND”. I am a big fan of Heat, a great modern crime movie with a loaded cast in Pacino, DeNiro, Val Kilmer, Jon Voight, Ashley Judd, Dennis Haybert, Natalie Portman. Wouldn’t be mad if it wasn’t on the list, but I like it. The Usual Suspects, in my top 5, no brainer on this list. Arguably one of the greatest “No fucking way” moments that leave you speechless in movie history, up there with the ending of Primal Fear. Kevin Spacey is incredible. I am going to keep Clueless on the list. Could go either way, started the careers of Alicia Silverstone and the late Brittany Murphy. Award for 30 year old playing a smoking high school girl goes to Stacey Dash, who may look hotter now at 44 than ever.


I am going to argue this is the most snubbed year based on the movies that made the list versus what didn’t make the list.


Great Movies: Apollo 13, Crimson Tide, Braveheart, Outbreak, Casino, Tommy Boy. The fact that none of these movies made it over Babe boggles my mind. Come on, Babe? Really Seth? Babe? REALLY?


Personal Favorites: Ace Ventura 2, GoldenEye, Seven, Bad Boys, Batman Forever
 
ETC: Fantastic analysis, It's almost exactly how i feel. Toy Story deserves to be on the list, really launched the Pixar revolution and look at how many great movies they've made since then. I love heat, but it is very long and there are some very slow parts, so I'm gonna leave it on the list just because of a few key scenes that make the movie. Usual Suspects is absolutely a no brainer. I think it's the greatest ending of any movie in the history of movies, better than Primal Fear (but that's very close). And whats amazing about Usual Suspects is that even when you rewatch the movie, and you know the ending, you're still fascinated and pick up on so many details that you missed the first time. Sometimes with ploy movies like that, you can't rewatch it because the "shock value" is lost, but that doesn't happen with suspects. Clueless definitely belongs as well no doubt about it. It's another generational movie, but this captured the 90s and it was made in the 90s. It will last and despite being one of the biggest chick flicks of all time, I love this movie and it's features Paul Rudd very early in his career as well.

This has been the most snubbed year so far, more so than the Carrey debacle of 94. Every movie you just listed as a snub are far and away superior movies than babe. In fact this could be argued as a reason that this list is terrible. Babe is on the list but all time classics like casino and braveheart are completely overlooked. And while we are picking on babe, we certainly cant leave Sense and Sensibility out of this argument. a hugh grant movie cant be said to a must see when we've got hanks, deniro, denzel and farley among others that were made this year. I dont think either of us have seen or heard of Living in Oblivion and before sunrise. And that doesnt mean they might not be good movies, but if both of us have never HEARD of them, they can't possibly be ranked about casino, braveheart or apollo 13 (and the rest of our snub lists)

Even your personal favorites, which would also be included on my personal favorites (or maybe guilty pleasure would be a better description) could be argued for, especially Seven. not to mention movies like billy madison, jumanji and die hard with a vengeance that are all enjoyable movies. Jumanji was innovative and unique and I'd much rather watch that than sense and sensibility.

*G-Chat Convo: haha excellent assesment, you almost took the words out of my mouth*
*Mr.IMDB, LTC: that whole year is a crime*


So that is our part 1 of our discussion. We broke it up by half decades, so Part 2 will range from 1996-1999. Mr. IMDB, Lenny the Critic and myself are having way too much fun with so we hope that you enjoy the debate as much as we do, and want to hear some feedback. So keep a heads up for Part 2 and until next time, as always....STAY SWEET!